GotPoetry.com > > Forums > > Poetry Workshops > > Post a poem > > Rules for this forum / Posting Guidelines / READ THIS FIRST
GotPoetry.com

Help
Toggle Content .:: Home :: Poems :: Workshop Forums :: Register :: Features ::.
Toggle Content Judge this Poem

Toggle Content User Info

Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password
(Register)

Membership:
Latest: cmestop4
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 16888

People Online:
Members: 1
Visitors: 150
Bots: 2
Staff: 0
Staff Online:

No staff currently online.

Toggle Content Paid Membership
Buy a paid membership and get more out of GotPoetry!

Advertise on the GotPoetry Advertising Network.

Toggle Content Donations
Donate with PayPal!
GotPoetry is a community supported site.
Due Date: Aug 31
August Goal: 180.00
Gross Amount: 0.00
PayPal Fees: 0.00
Net Balance: 0.00
Below Goal: 180.00
Site Currency: USD
 0%

Toggle Content Top Poetry Clubs

Forums > > Poetry Workshops > > Post a poem > > Rules for this forum / Posting Guidelines / READ THIS FIRST
My PostsMy Posts  SearchSearch   visitView posts since last: visitdayweekmonth

Rules for this forum / Posting Guidelines / READ THIS FIRST


Post new topic   This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies.     |##| -> |=|      Forum Index > > Post a poem
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
John
SysOp


SysOp



Joined: Mar 12, 1999
Posts: 5913
Credits: 130
Location: Rhode Island

PostPosted: Thu Sep 15 7:47:22 EDT 2005    Post subject: Rules for this forum / Posting Guidelines / READ THIS FIRST Reply with quote

What are you looking for?
These forums are workshops. If you just want your poem out there to get general feedback, use the poetry section. This area is for working on your poems. If you are not amenable to ever editing your work after your write it, don't seek opinions in these workshop forums.

Revisions

Post revisions or new versions of your poem as a reply to your original. Don't go back and change your original if you have a new draft. Doing that gets really confusing.


Posting Poems

The 2-1 rule is active in all the poetry, stories, and art sections.

What this means, is that for every poem you post, you must reply to two other poems/art-pieces in the workshop forums, and we don't mean one-word-replies or a single short phrase.

Posting For Serious Critique

If you would like your work to receive the highest possible critique, and the most honest opinions about it, then do not post in this board. If you are seeking an extensive critique, then you should post your work in 'The Rewrite Workshop'. Don't worry, honest critique is only half scary.

Here's a set series of guidelines (not RULES) for giving useful constructive feedback on a poem.

1. Be specific, not general. "This was nice" is general. "This really gave me the feeling of confusion the speaker was feeling" is better.

2. Try using the phrases "What worked for me was..." and/or "What would have made this work better for me..." Such feedback helps the poet to make any changes they may want to make...which leads me to:

3. Poets: don't feel compelled to take anyone's feedback if you believe strongly in the way you've written the poem. Be Nice, however, about how you respond to the feedback...try "thanks for that. I think I'm gonna let it sit for a bit before I decide how to proceed, though."

4. DON'T assume the voice of the poem is the voice of the poet. If you're gonna offer critique on a poem (and hell, if you're going to write one), please understand that lots of poems are not the unburdened confessions of tortured souls. (Mine rarely are. I frequently write about stuff that's not factual -- as oppose to being "untrue.") Try to restrict yourself to comments about the way the poem works as opposed to commiserating with the writer.

5. If someone tells you they are offended by something you wrote in a poem, there's only one thing appropriate to do: apologize immediately and then ask for an explanation. Offense is offense. You may not understand it, you most likely didn't mean to offend, but when you do it behooves you to listen to why what you said was offensive. It's not the other person's fault. (As with all feedback, what you then do or do not do with the poem is your decision -- but at least listen to what the other person has to say, k?)


ALSO! Post your poems in one forum on the board only. Disk space is not free, so don't make it worse by doubling up and duplicating. If it's too bad, we'll just delete all your posts and be done with it.

If you need something in two places, Private Message me or Nate. We can shadow the post for you.

If you are not getting a response on a poem and would like one, comment on someone Else's and then specifically ask them to comment on yours.

The vision for the GotPoetry forums is that all of the forums are ALL workshops. If you post in the 'Post a Poem' forum or the 'Rewrite Workshop' then you are asking for feed back - be it negative or positive. The Rewrite Workshop forum is to really tear apart and rework a poem.

If you are giving feedback, you HAVE to state why. A short 'this sucks' doesn't cut it.

If you can't figure out that a person responding to your work with 'this sucks' is implying 'IMO', or 'IMHO' or 'In My Honest Opinion the poem sucks' then you have issues. Should anybody be phrasing responses like that? No. The problem is that the internet turns weak wimpy soft spoken people into opinionated jerks that will say things in ways that would get them punched in the face if they were face to face with the author of the poem.

So again, and to restate, if you don't want someone to tell you that they don't like your work and why, then post your poem in your Blog'. That's what the Blogs are there for.

When you write a critique or response, pretend that the person is sitting next to you and can and will punch you in the face if you are enough of a jerk. This is a writing site, use your craft and choose your words in a way that helps the dialogue.

Smite someone's karma when they're being a jerk. That's what its there for. If you don't feel like calling someone out in the forum for lazy responses, then do it anonymously with the tools you are given.

Remember, these are guidelines, but if these rules are totally ignored then action will eventually be taken.

John Lennon wrote:
Would those of you in the cheaper seats clap your hands? And the rest of you, if you'll just rattle your jewelry.

_________________
Please ask questions and make requests at the Help Desk. Emailing and and PM'ing staff members is the slow way to go.


Last edited by John on Mon Aug 25 13:57:01 EDT 2008; edited 5 times in total
Karma: 2987.05

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address MSN Messenger Photo Gallery
AlvinLau
Authors and Extras


Authors and Extras



Joined: Jan 08, 2007
Posts: 578
Credits: 135
Location: Chicago

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11 10:25:25 EDT 2007    Post subject: critique challenge Reply with quote

did you know that giving thorough, line by line critique can often reveal as much to you about poetry as writing the poem yourself, if not more?

for every single person who wants to get fantastic, multi-faceted critique from the boards, you need to give it as well.

so here's the challenge:

1) for every poem, make your critique at least as long as that poem.

because surely, if someone spent 10 hours redrafting a poem, a ten word breakdown would be insufficient.

2) when making suggestions, try to offer the general reasoning behind the suggestion, not just the incredibly specific "you don't need a comma at S3L2."

you're trying to provide the fishing rod and not the fish yadda.

3) for balance purposes, have your critique be 50/50 positive / negative.

no matter how much you enjoy a poem, the writer is asking for constructive feedback and how to improve every minute detail. remember saying "this is amazing" is EXACTLY as constructive as "this is terrible."

4) maintain as high a credit rating as possible, that is, critique much more often than you post.


I bet if people followed through with this, especially the more experienced writers, the work on this board would improve dramatically.
Karma: 152.00

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Photo Gallery
John
SysOp


SysOp



Joined: Mar 12, 1999
Posts: 5913
Credits: 130
Location: Rhode Island

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11 11:06:22 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

Made Sticky by me.

I expect to soon integrate this advice into the forum posting guidelines. So far I agree with Alvin. I'd like to hear what others have to say.

_________________
Please ask questions and make requests at the Help Desk. Emailing and and PM'ing staff members is the slow way to go.
Karma: 2987.05

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address MSN Messenger Photo Gallery
jesster
Has written an Occasional poem or two.


Has written an Occasional poem or two.
Staff Picks!Staff Picks/August 2011


Joined: Dec 29, 2006
Posts: 652
Credits: 149
Location: Salt Lake City, UT

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11 11:51:08 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

I am floored by how well this advice is constructed. Well done.

-Jesster

_________________
AKA Jesse Parent
My Facebook - Salt City Slam - Slammaster

"Best hyberbole ever!"
Karma: 593.10

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
crlpr11
Has written an Occasional poem or two.


Has written an Occasional poem or two.



Joined: Aug 20, 2006
Posts: 798
Credits: 46
Location: Boston

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11 12:12:13 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

I very rarely use the karma tool. Alvin got good karma from me today.

_________________
-c-

caralisapowers.wordpress.com
www.projectthinkdifferent.org ~My Day Job
Karma: 125.40

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address
Rax
"I am RAREFIED!!!"



Poet of the Month!Staff Picks!


Joined: Mar 21, 2007
Posts: 1575
Credits: 202
Location: Philippines

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11 12:28:01 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

impressive. karma from me

_________________
To live outside the law you must be honest - Bob Dylan
Karma: 4179.45

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Deleted_User_1586
Has written an Occasional poem or two.


Has written an Occasional poem or two.



Joined: Feb 12, 2006
Posts: 658
Credits: 28


PostPosted: Mon Jun 11 15:30:03 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

Please can you post an example?

A common standard of poem and a good example of critique so that I can see what I am aiming for.
Karma: 114.25

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
greygrynn
Site Curator


Site Curator
Staff Picks!


Joined: Aug 15, 2006
Posts: 1257
Credits: 332
Location: Earth (Most of the Time!)

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11 15:45:35 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

Another awesome post - incredibly useful – Thanks Alvin! Smile

_________________
Reading makes a Writer reach/stretch to be better than the day before
Karma: 293.25

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
chameleon
Staff


Staff
Award staff member for JudgingGP staff judgeGP Staff Judges!


Joined: May 23, 2006
Posts: 3131
Credits: 378
Location: 42.280163/-71.793345

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11 17:08:25 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

I think it's excellent advice and a good standard to shoot for. I don't want to be negative here, but I also think it may be a little intimidating for those who might offer useful advice on one or two places that they see rough spots, but don't feel up to the task of giving a line-by-line crit of every poem they want to comment on.

I still think it's a great idea to incorporate it in the forum posting guidelines and applaud Alvin for the sound, direct advice (and for the crit that he offers people). I'd just hate to see people offer nothing because they don't feel they can live up to that standard.

_________________
Blog: www.girlswantporn.com
Writing Ideas and Challenges: www.findmymuse.com
Because Poetry Should Be Heard: www.speakingofpoetry.com
Karma: 3927.25

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
AlvinLau
Authors and Extras


Authors and Extras



Joined: Jan 08, 2007
Posts: 578
Credits: 135
Location: Chicago

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11 17:55:55 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

oh jeez, what a downer post. as if enough people are going to take this seriously enough for that to happen.
Karma: 152.00

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Photo Gallery
chameleon
Staff


Staff
Award staff member for JudgingGP staff judgeGP Staff Judges!


Joined: May 23, 2006
Posts: 3131
Credits: 378
Location: 42.280163/-71.793345

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11 18:36:20 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

John asked for feedback, I gave it. I think your challenge is an excellent one, or I wouldn't have said so. I'd love to see more people doing crits that way, and I have /always/ been impressed by the feedback you give when you choose to. You challenge people to think about what they're writing and why they made the choices that they made, which is exactly what crit should do.

As a challenge, I think this is wonderful. As guidelines, I think it becomes intimidating to a lot of people. You're right - 'enough people' won't take it seriously enough to shut up the forums - but I've heard enough people say 'I'm not qualified to comment on this' to know that some people will avoid saying anything if they can't give a full line-by-line. What I'd like to see is for your post to go up in the sticky section of the workshop forums complete with the title "Critique Challenge".

_________________
Blog: www.girlswantporn.com
Writing Ideas and Challenges: www.findmymuse.com
Because Poetry Should Be Heard: www.speakingofpoetry.com
Karma: 3927.25

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
AlvinLau
Authors and Extras


Authors and Extras



Joined: Jan 08, 2007
Posts: 578
Credits: 135
Location: Chicago

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11 18:38:03 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

doesn't it already have that title?
Karma: 152.00

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Photo Gallery
lukaki26
"I am RAREFIED!!!"



Staff Picks/March 2013Staff Picks/April 2013


Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1556
Credits: 8
Location: East Sussex, England

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11 19:14:17 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

Alvin, I have had a number of one phraze comments from you, which I found abrubt and unhelpful, If you want this to happen start by example.
I do always appreciate a well thought out response, but if someone just wants to write a couple of things then that's cool too.
I find comments solely on grammar and readability very helpful at times.
I do find one or two line comments slightly irritating, it's like: why bother.
I often find I have something to comment on, without wanting to enter an in depth critique. I for one would like to have that choice.

_________________
In my case, failing to accumulate wealth or achieve social standing is not an alternative lifestyle choice, it is purely down to ineptitude.
Karma: 673.95

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
chameleon
Staff


Staff
Award staff member for JudgingGP staff judgeGP Staff Judges!


Joined: May 23, 2006
Posts: 3131
Credits: 378
Location: 42.280163/-71.793345

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11 19:16:25 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

It does. And if you read John's post right after yours, he says

john wrote:
I expect to soon integrate this advice into the forum posting guidelines.

That is what I was really responding to. Like I said, I think your post is excellent. It absolutely should be kept where people will read it and think about how they critique others' work. John didn't specify HOW he is planning to integrate it, and that's the issue I was raising.

_________________
Blog: www.girlswantporn.com
Writing Ideas and Challenges: www.findmymuse.com
Because Poetry Should Be Heard: www.speakingofpoetry.com
Karma: 3927.25

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
AlvinLau
Authors and Extras


Authors and Extras



Joined: Jan 08, 2007
Posts: 578
Credits: 135
Location: Chicago

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11 19:17:07 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

Dude:

1) I've given plenty of other critique on these boards. I've just never found your work to have enough depth to dig through.

2) It's not some mandatory rule, it's a personal challenge. If you don't want to do it then don't.
Karma: 152.00

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Photo Gallery
lukaki26
"I am RAREFIED!!!"



Staff Picks/March 2013Staff Picks/April 2013


Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1556
Credits: 8
Location: East Sussex, England

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11 19:24:19 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

If you have nothing to say, apart from the rhyming makes it juvenile on two seperate responses, the don't comment at all. I understand you may not find my work particularly interesting, I have no problem with that whatsover.
I have read many of your critiques, and appreciate that they are often very good ones.
Karma: 673.95

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
oldschooldetroit
Wrote Lyric Verse at least once.


Wrote Lyric Verse at least once.



Joined: May 03, 2007
Posts: 424
Credits: 1
Location: Detroit, MI

PostPosted: Tue Jun 12 15:48:07 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

That's an excellent idea Alvin.

He has given constructive & positive feedback/critique on poems posted. Even mine!

Karma for that, & this post Al!

_________________
In the Daddyhood..., we take care of our kids...
Karma: 56.30

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
oldschooldetroit
Wrote Lyric Verse at least once.


Wrote Lyric Verse at least once.



Joined: May 03, 2007
Posts: 424
Credits: 1
Location: Detroit, MI

PostPosted: Tue Jun 12 15:49:56 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

[quote="AlvinLau"]did you know that giving thorough, line by line critique can often reveal as much to you about poetry as writing the poem yourself, if not more?

for every single person who wants to get fantastic, multi-faceted critique from the boards, you need to give it as well.

so here's the challenge:

1) for every poem, make your critique at least as long as that poem.

because surely, if someone spent 10 hours redrafting a poem, a ten word breakdown would be insufficient.


I'd expect & hope that NO ONE HAS 10 HOURS TO SPEND REDRAFTING 1 POEM! Smile

_________________
In the Daddyhood..., we take care of our kids...
Karma: 56.30

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
Tony
"I'm not mad. I'm just PISSED OFF!"



Staff Picks!Critic!Judge - holiday poetry contest


Joined: Nov 13, 2002
Posts: 4102
Credits: 196


PostPosted: Tue Jun 12 16:05:46 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

oldschooldetroit wrote:


I'd expect & hope that NO ONE HAS 10 HOURS TO SPEND REDRAFTING 1 POEM! Smile

I spend that regularly. In fact, I usually spend a hell of a lot more. I've got a couple in the hopper that have been around for months, and they've gotten tons of attention.
Karma: 2106.50

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
lordfuznut
Beauty's but the beginning of terror


Beauty's but the beginning of terror
Staff Picks!Haiku contest - 2nd placeStaff Picks!Best Critic!


Joined: Feb 10, 2007
Posts: 3941
Credits: 4
Location: Planet Fuznut

PostPosted: Tue Jun 12 16:59:33 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

lukaki26 wrote:
Alvin, I have had a number of one phraze comments from you, which I found abrubt and unhelpful, If you want this to happen start by example.
I do always appreciate a well thought out response, but if someone just wants to write a couple of things then that's cool too.
I find comments solely on grammar and readability very helpful at times.
I do find one or two line comments slightly irritating, it's like: why bother.
I often find I have something to comment on, without wanting to enter an in depth critique. I for one would like to have that choice.

yeah

_________________
sign here

www.reverbnation.com/planetfuznut
Karma: 330.55

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
AlvinLau
Authors and Extras


Authors and Extras



Joined: Jan 08, 2007
Posts: 578
Credits: 135
Location: Chicago

PostPosted: Tue Jun 12 22:14:04 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

oldschooldetroit wrote:
I'd expect & hope that NO ONE HAS 10 HOURS TO SPEND REDRAFTING 1 POEM! Smile

Really? Try six months.
Karma: 152.00

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Photo Gallery
Rax
"I am RAREFIED!!!"



Poet of the Month!Staff Picks!


Joined: Mar 21, 2007
Posts: 1575
Credits: 202
Location: Philippines

PostPosted: Wed Jun 13 1:49:59 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

Tony wrote:
oldschooldetroit wrote:


I'd expect & hope that NO ONE HAS 10 HOURS TO SPEND REDRAFTING 1 POEM! Smile

I spend that regularly. In fact, I usually spend a hell of a lot more. I've got a couple in the hopper that have been around for months, and they've gotten tons of attention.

do that as well. and i still dont feel its ever enough.

_________________
To live outside the law you must be honest - Bob Dylan
Karma: 4179.45

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
oldschooldetroit
Wrote Lyric Verse at least once.


Wrote Lyric Verse at least once.



Joined: May 03, 2007
Posts: 424
Credits: 1
Location: Detroit, MI

PostPosted: Wed Jun 13 15:28:21 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

Rax wrote:
Tony wrote:
oldschooldetroit wrote:


I'd expect & hope that NO ONE HAS 10 HOURS TO SPEND REDRAFTING 1 POEM! Smile

I spend that regularly. In fact, I usually spend a hell of a lot more. I've got a couple in the hopper that have been around for months, and they've gotten tons of attention.

do that as well. and i still dont feel its ever enough.

After some thought, I recall that I have taken some months to complete some of my songs/rhymes/poems (some that I've posted on this site). No disrespect intended to anyone on the site.

My sincerest apologies!

_________________
In the Daddyhood..., we take care of our kids...
Karma: 56.30

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
lordfuznut
Beauty's but the beginning of terror


Beauty's but the beginning of terror
Staff Picks!Haiku contest - 2nd placeStaff Picks!Best Critic!


Joined: Feb 10, 2007
Posts: 3941
Credits: 4
Location: Planet Fuznut

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19 11:58:18 EDT 2007    Post subject: Re: critique challenge Reply with quote

ye olde

_________________
sign here

www.reverbnation.com/planetfuznut
Karma: 330.55

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies.     |##| -> |=|      Forum Index > > Post a poem All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Page 1 of 1


Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
 Forum FAQForum FAQ




GotPoetry - News for poets. Place to write.

GotPoetry is the most popular network of performance poets and poetry readings on the internet today.

Editors: John, Mamta and a cast of tens of others.
Publisher: John Powers

Content © 1998-2008
GotPoetry LLC. All rights reserved

Engine released under GNU GPL, Code Credits, Privacy Policy, Legal Notices

Search:
 
GotPoetry.com Web

Forums Search
Gallery Search
Advanced Search


Link to Full Archives
Link to all News Topics


Link for all submission options for this site.

Subscribe - Use an RSS reader to stay up to date with the latest news and posts from GotPoetry.

GotPoetry News RSS Feed

Subscribe with Yahoo!
Subscribe with Google

Other GotPoetry RSS Syndication -  You can syndicate other parts of our site using the following files:

Yesterday's Top News
Yesterday's Top Poems
Forums
New Photos
Blogs
Downloads
Featured Articles